Because then all you are is unironically a cancerous growth within society like the morbidly obese and unemployment abusers. To participate within society you sign and agree with the contractual terms. Nothing in this world is free of resource and labor, thereby nothing can be given without getting. It’s the basic core of a finite resource, be it time or material. The idea that “enough people have ambition that we can support the lazy to fuck off until they die” is so unequivocally revolting.
‘If a man will not work, he shall not eat’ applies to the same principle of a UBI. If you wish not to assist in continuing our society further and assist in the services needed to operate, then you deserve nothing and should be left behind. Work on improving the conditions afforded workers and the work available, rather than incentiving actual mongrel degeneracy.
We are already being robbed every day, all profits of the working people are being funneled to the rich. Whatever amount this average teenager could waste by not working is completely insignificant compared to the trillions spent on speculation, weapons, political manipulation, and other billions of dollars spent on things that make all of our lives worse. How much money do you think a trillion dollars is? We are being tricked every day. There are billionaires that sit on their ass and do less than any lazy average person, and make thousands while doing it.
Current populist rhetoric using half truths is all this is. Yes there are reasons to be upset at our current situation, but the easy out of “muh billionaires” is so lackadaisical and falsified as a straw man for the stock market, politicians, and evil people who are actually an issue.
Lazy people are exactly the reason why shit is so bad as is. Look at any period of history pre-80s and you’ll find a group of unified citizens actually doing something about their issue and making the government fear them using the necessary violence (the only language these fuckers understand as it removes their control through ‘civility’). Now you say you want to give rise to a new class that happily takes their state mandated paycheck and then sits on their ass to not question why things aren’t getting any better. Yeah no, it fucking disgusts me, this philosophy.
Yeah it’s not just ‘the billionaires’ that’s obviously a short hand for the greater issue. You hear about those people because they made differences, but throughout history most people are just as lazy as they are now. Sitting down and not working itself is a form of rebelling against this fucking bullshit that wants us to do something all the time. Fuck that, for what? I want to make the government fear the people that want to sit and do nothing. Because what the fuck is life for. What are you living for?
Family, myself, and the collective good that has allowed some like my friends with diabetes who would be dead without the efforts made by all to allow those who would have died otherwise a fair chance. Anyone capable of work has a moral obligation to assist in upkeep of a better society. The government doesn’t fear people sitting on their ass, they fear the ones willing to die before giving up their rights. It’s literally how history speaks of every successful government rebellion.
That’s the thing though, you can’t just sit on your ass, so the people most dedicated to that have to fight for the right haha. I agree though, everyone should work as hard as they can in the face of what is happening. Some people have different levels of what they can do while still being productive in their efforts, and I think that can look lazy sometimes to people. With too much strain or anxiety or whatever, a persons work could be counterproductive to the efforts they are trying to achieve. Sometimes doing nothing is the better option for a person’s situation.
Sure, but your proposed idea was to allow (in my perception of your explanation) literal shut ins who don’t provide ANYTHING be it entertainment, production, service, education etc, and just sit inside collecting a check while gaming or binging shows all day. That’s not useful to anyone least of all themselves from a health perspective, and becomes a cancerous drain in multiple ways. THAT disgusts me. I have no issue with giving it to someone like my friend who only works weekends taking care of mentally challenged kids for a center. He has awful back issues and the levels of labor that he can meet are very restricted. But he still offers something to the world, in the manner he can. That’s respectable and should be incentivized.
Well I don’t think most people should be doing that, I just believe the vast majority of people actually do want to do productive work, more than enough for society to function just fine if some people were shut-ins, I don’t think it’s a good thing to do and you’re right it’s bad for your health. We’ve had large societies long before the economic system we have now, and with technology, work that would take substantially longer in the past can be done more quickly with fewer people today.
You benefit from the resource and labor collectivized to ensure you don’t have to eat rotten food every night, sleep outside and die of exposure, or die in a bloody war against your will. It is a miracle you’re even allowed to live considering how rough all of human history has been, and to ensure that keeps going while you benefit from it, you agree to assist in maintenance.
All that comes from the exploitation of the human population. If everyone was out to better the world we would be leagues further than where we are now. But a handful of people do and spend everything they can to stay in power.
Even if we overlooked all the exploitation that happened, where we are now thanks to everyone in human history, we don’t need to work like we have in the past. Everything can be automated and everyone happier. But then the rich and powerful wouldn’t get to be rich and powerful
I don’t disagree on exploitation, my point is your rhetoric has lost the plot.
You physically cannot automate everything. Human input is always needed somewhere. There isn’t enough resources on the planet to just wish problems away, everything atrophies, everything needs doing to get. Just because we don’t work as hard as we did, doesn’t mean we don’t still have to work. There are necessary labor inputs to upkeep what we have achieved, and anyone who benefits and is capable should help ensure that everyone else can enjoy the same benefits going forward.
Wise men plant the seeds of a tree whose shade they will never know. Anyone not disabled, a child, or dead should contribute.
Not once did I say this wasn’t true. My point is we shouldn’t incentivize people to become wastes of resources and collective action if they are capable of contributing.
Because then all you are is unironically a cancerous growth within society like the morbidly obese and unemployment abusers. To participate within society you sign and agree with the contractual terms. Nothing in this world is free of resource and labor, thereby nothing can be given without getting. It’s the basic core of a finite resource, be it time or material. The idea that “enough people have ambition that we can support the lazy to fuck off until they die” is so unequivocally revolting.
‘If a man will not work, he shall not eat’ applies to the same principle of a UBI. If you wish not to assist in continuing our society further and assist in the services needed to operate, then you deserve nothing and should be left behind. Work on improving the conditions afforded workers and the work available, rather than incentiving actual mongrel degeneracy.
We are already being robbed every day, all profits of the working people are being funneled to the rich. Whatever amount this average teenager could waste by not working is completely insignificant compared to the trillions spent on speculation, weapons, political manipulation, and other billions of dollars spent on things that make all of our lives worse. How much money do you think a trillion dollars is? We are being tricked every day. There are billionaires that sit on their ass and do less than any lazy average person, and make thousands while doing it.
Current populist rhetoric using half truths is all this is. Yes there are reasons to be upset at our current situation, but the easy out of “muh billionaires” is so lackadaisical and falsified as a straw man for the stock market, politicians, and evil people who are actually an issue.
Lazy people are exactly the reason why shit is so bad as is. Look at any period of history pre-80s and you’ll find a group of unified citizens actually doing something about their issue and making the government fear them using the necessary violence (the only language these fuckers understand as it removes their control through ‘civility’). Now you say you want to give rise to a new class that happily takes their state mandated paycheck and then sits on their ass to not question why things aren’t getting any better. Yeah no, it fucking disgusts me, this philosophy.
Yeah it’s not just ‘the billionaires’ that’s obviously a short hand for the greater issue. You hear about those people because they made differences, but throughout history most people are just as lazy as they are now. Sitting down and not working itself is a form of rebelling against this fucking bullshit that wants us to do something all the time. Fuck that, for what? I want to make the government fear the people that want to sit and do nothing. Because what the fuck is life for. What are you living for?
Family, myself, and the collective good that has allowed some like my friends with diabetes who would be dead without the efforts made by all to allow those who would have died otherwise a fair chance. Anyone capable of work has a moral obligation to assist in upkeep of a better society. The government doesn’t fear people sitting on their ass, they fear the ones willing to die before giving up their rights. It’s literally how history speaks of every successful government rebellion.
That’s the thing though, you can’t just sit on your ass, so the people most dedicated to that have to fight for the right haha. I agree though, everyone should work as hard as they can in the face of what is happening. Some people have different levels of what they can do while still being productive in their efforts, and I think that can look lazy sometimes to people. With too much strain or anxiety or whatever, a persons work could be counterproductive to the efforts they are trying to achieve. Sometimes doing nothing is the better option for a person’s situation.
Sure, but your proposed idea was to allow (in my perception of your explanation) literal shut ins who don’t provide ANYTHING be it entertainment, production, service, education etc, and just sit inside collecting a check while gaming or binging shows all day. That’s not useful to anyone least of all themselves from a health perspective, and becomes a cancerous drain in multiple ways. THAT disgusts me. I have no issue with giving it to someone like my friend who only works weekends taking care of mentally challenged kids for a center. He has awful back issues and the levels of labor that he can meet are very restricted. But he still offers something to the world, in the manner he can. That’s respectable and should be incentivized.
Well I don’t think most people should be doing that, I just believe the vast majority of people actually do want to do productive work, more than enough for society to function just fine if some people were shut-ins, I don’t think it’s a good thing to do and you’re right it’s bad for your health. We’ve had large societies long before the economic system we have now, and with technology, work that would take substantially longer in the past can be done more quickly with fewer people today.
I don’t remember signing shit before I was born. Lemme see that contract.
You benefit from the resource and labor collectivized to ensure you don’t have to eat rotten food every night, sleep outside and die of exposure, or die in a bloody war against your will. It is a miracle you’re even allowed to live considering how rough all of human history has been, and to ensure that keeps going while you benefit from it, you agree to assist in maintenance.
All that comes from the exploitation of the human population. If everyone was out to better the world we would be leagues further than where we are now. But a handful of people do and spend everything they can to stay in power.
Even if we overlooked all the exploitation that happened, where we are now thanks to everyone in human history, we don’t need to work like we have in the past. Everything can be automated and everyone happier. But then the rich and powerful wouldn’t get to be rich and powerful
I don’t disagree on exploitation, my point is your rhetoric has lost the plot.
You physically cannot automate everything. Human input is always needed somewhere. There isn’t enough resources on the planet to just wish problems away, everything atrophies, everything needs doing to get. Just because we don’t work as hard as we did, doesn’t mean we don’t still have to work. There are necessary labor inputs to upkeep what we have achieved, and anyone who benefits and is capable should help ensure that everyone else can enjoy the same benefits going forward.
Wise men plant the seeds of a tree whose shade they will never know. Anyone not disabled, a child, or dead should contribute.
We could automate enough to make UBI a thing. Then nobody has to work a shitty back breaking demoralizing job and can then focus on better things.
Obviously there will be some shitty jobs that are an exception but you get what I’m saying. UBI for all
“You should be grateful serving your betters. Kneel like a good peasant, and I’ll let you have a chicken bone to eat.”
You should be happy serving your community and benefiting society. Live for something greater than yourself.
You can serve your community and benefit society without making the rich richer.
Not once did I say this wasn’t true. My point is we shouldn’t incentivize people to become wastes of resources and collective action if they are capable of contributing.