it really isn’t, but if all you can say is “that’s a lot of text” then idk what to tell you. Maybe stick around with an open mind and try interacting with the community for a while! You could start by asking (good faith) questions in a few threads, like “oh why do you people support X (genuine question)” and you’ll not only be met with respect but have the opportunity to have a proper discussion.
I truly appreciate the offer and I do see a lot of posts from the group in my feed so I get some sense of the ethos but be honest. Seeing the meme that started this thread is not a good-faith “let’s discuss the differences” that some of you seem to be saying the group is made up of. It’s more along the lines of “Let’s shit on this thing over here, say our thing is awesome, even through it’s awfully flawed as well” and then half your crew falls apart when someone points that out.
I often do find myself with questions regarding what makes the community so fervent but in fairness, anyone that believes the bullshit being pedaled in the meme would not be someone I would expect a level-headed explanation from.
I understand, and I also won’t deny there are people online who glorify China (and past Socialism, such as the Eastern Bloc) and genuinely believe everything there was/is perfect. To me, it’s as anticommunist and dangerous to believe and promote this narrative as the opposite one, where everything there is dystopian, freedom doesn’t exist and whatnot. To pretend a problem in a given social system either doesn’t exist or that is being addressed correctly will only make things worse for the people living under that system.
In Blackshirts and Reds, Parenti goes in great detail about the deficiencies of the former Eastern Bloc in Chapter 4. It’s a great book overall, and easy to read.
China is a country with a very complex history (bound to happen when your civilisation spans over 5000 years) that barely managed to free itself from the shackles of Imperialism, so to believe that after 1949 (founding of the PRC) every single problem of the old society went away is just wishful thinking. They made many mistakes and there was excess mortality in many instances, for example the Cultural Revolution. They’ve improved a lot since then, but still have ways to go as Socialist construction progresses.
Lastly, as for the contents of the meme, yeah I’m not a great fan of these so I can relate to you in this regard.
Without a hint of sarcasm, I would like to say that I’ve truly enjoyed reading your comments. Thanks for the thoughtful and informative discussion. It was a bright spot in my day.
In Blackshirts and Reds, Parenti goes in great detail about the deficiencies of the former Eastern Bloc in Chapter 4. It’s a great book overall, and easy to read.
I downloaded it and will try to give it a read. As was pointed out by one of your comrades, I have to sound out the words so sometimes a lot of the context is lost on me.
I know this is digging up an old thread, but I’d be interested to hear your thoughts on Blackshirts and Reds?
For me, the historical context provided in this book was very eye-opening and a big part of what led me to dig deeper into how socialism works outside of the anti-communist propaganda I’d been fed throughout my life and formal education.
I’m sorry for the delay in replying. The book is incredibly eye-opening but it’s one I will have to read more than once. My struggle is not just what I’ve been taught in the past but also how little I looked for myself. It’s shocking how much I have to Google while reading it.
It’s shocking how much I have to Google while reading it.
We all go through it, even if it’s just learning terms we’re unfamiliar with. Your other points resonate with me as well. It can take a lot of effort to work through (because there’s so much to read!), but I’ve also found it’s been very rewarding.
Thank you for taking the time to read it. Most people we encounter don’t even bother to engage with anything that opposes their established worldview. It’s not trivial and requires an inquisitive mind. Many people don’t care enough to even try.
it really isn’t, but if all you can say is “that’s a lot of text” then idk what to tell you. Maybe stick around with an open mind and try interacting with the community for a while! You could start by asking (good faith) questions in a few threads, like “oh why do you people support X (genuine question)” and you’ll not only be met with respect but have the opportunity to have a proper discussion.
I truly appreciate the offer and I do see a lot of posts from the group in my feed so I get some sense of the ethos but be honest. Seeing the meme that started this thread is not a good-faith “let’s discuss the differences” that some of you seem to be saying the group is made up of. It’s more along the lines of “Let’s shit on this thing over here, say our thing is awesome, even through it’s awfully flawed as well” and then half your crew falls apart when someone points that out.
I often do find myself with questions regarding what makes the community so fervent but in fairness, anyone that believes the bullshit being pedaled in the meme would not be someone I would expect a level-headed explanation from.
I understand, and I also won’t deny there are people online who glorify China (and past Socialism, such as the Eastern Bloc) and genuinely believe everything there was/is perfect. To me, it’s as anticommunist and dangerous to believe and promote this narrative as the opposite one, where everything there is dystopian, freedom doesn’t exist and whatnot. To pretend a problem in a given social system either doesn’t exist or that is being addressed correctly will only make things worse for the people living under that system.
In Blackshirts and Reds, Parenti goes in great detail about the deficiencies of the former Eastern Bloc in Chapter 4. It’s a great book overall, and easy to read.
China is a country with a very complex history (bound to happen when your civilisation spans over 5000 years) that barely managed to free itself from the shackles of Imperialism, so to believe that after 1949 (founding of the PRC) every single problem of the old society went away is just wishful thinking. They made many mistakes and there was excess mortality in many instances, for example the Cultural Revolution. They’ve improved a lot since then, but still have ways to go as Socialist construction progresses.
Lastly, as for the contents of the meme, yeah I’m not a great fan of these so I can relate to you in this regard.
Without a hint of sarcasm, I would like to say that I’ve truly enjoyed reading your comments. Thanks for the thoughtful and informative discussion. It was a bright spot in my day.
I downloaded it and will try to give it a read. As was pointed out by one of your comrades, I have to sound out the words so sometimes a lot of the context is lost on me.
Ah, no worries, I’m glad I could be of help. Have a nice week and don’t hesitate to ask questions on other posts if you’d like.
I know this is digging up an old thread, but I’d be interested to hear your thoughts on Blackshirts and Reds?
For me, the historical context provided in this book was very eye-opening and a big part of what led me to dig deeper into how socialism works outside of the anti-communist propaganda I’d been fed throughout my life and formal education.
I’m sorry for the delay in replying. The book is incredibly eye-opening but it’s one I will have to read more than once. My struggle is not just what I’ve been taught in the past but also how little I looked for myself. It’s shocking how much I have to Google while reading it.
We all go through it, even if it’s just learning terms we’re unfamiliar with. Your other points resonate with me as well. It can take a lot of effort to work through (because there’s so much to read!), but I’ve also found it’s been very rewarding.
Thank you for taking the time to read it. Most people we encounter don’t even bother to engage with anything that opposes their established worldview. It’s not trivial and requires an inquisitive mind. Many people don’t care enough to even try.