Yes. And communist, fascist, and dictator mean 3 very different things. I used to think they were synonymous, too, but they’re not.
Communist and fascist are polar opposites. Authoritarian is the extremes of both sides. A dictator can exist at any point in the spectrum, and isn’t unique to any side.
It really does help if we can agree what words mean.
“That didn’t happen.
And if it did, it wasn’t that bad.
And if it was, that’s not a big deal.
And if it is, that’s not my fault.
And if it was, I didn’t mean it.
And if I did, you deserved it.”
I’m not defending anything. You seem too defensive for this conversation, if that’s what you think. (Judging by you downvoting my comments before you even reply, that’s becoming obvious.)
Can you actually define the words you’re using, even to yourself? Or are you lashing out at me based on what you feel they mean?
I’m willing to talk to you, but only if we can agree upon what words like ‘socialism’ mean. If not, we’ll only talk past each other, and I think you’ll agree that will waste both of our time.
Are you trying to say that authoritarianism is a component of fascism, but fascism isn’t the only type of authoritarianism? 'Cause that’s not super clear from your wording.
That’s not the definition of the term, by any ones analysis. The simplest, original definition is that fascism is state and corporate power combined. Like the US has been for half a century.
Not really, you’re the one that is just taking all 1.67 inches of capitalist dick while trying to redefine fascism away from Mussolini’s definition so you can protect the status quo you have been sold as ‘not perfect but the best we’ve come up with’.
Capitalism and liberalism have always lead to fascism. They are the only ideologies to ever develop into fascism. Socialism and communism, maybe even anarchism are the only future humanity has. Humanity can’t coexist with capitalists long term.
And if you knew anything about socialism you’d support the cpc. Maybe not the ussr but we’ve learned from their failures.
China is a fully socialist state. If you think otherwise you either stopped paying attention to socialism in the mid 1800s, or you don’t know enough about China.
I think when most people fantasize about socialism they are thinking of Nordic style and not authoritarian CCP style.
My litmus test is the ability to openly criticize your government. In an open and free society this is allowed.
Any authoritarian society, regardless of economic system, is not in the right track. In my opinion. Then again I only consume western media so maybe the CCP isn’t that bad. Can you tell me what happened on June 4th, 1989?
I’m surprised the comments seem to be defending authoritarianism like it’s any more acceptable than fascism.
“Stalin may have had millions of people killed and fueled the negative reputation of communism world wide for nearly a century, but at least he wasn’t a fascist.”. I don’t seem to understand why democratic social ownership is considered a worse alternative than letting a centralized tyrannical government harm people unchecked.
Authoritarian != communism. Authoritarianism applies equally to communism and fascism. The latter two describe ideology, where ‘authoritarian’ describes scale. Your sentence is like if I said I I use reds, not apples, in my pies. It sort of makes sense, but not really.
You said: ‘I don’t seem to understand why democratic social ownership is considered a worse alternative’ yes, exactly! That’s socialism, which is an economic – not a political – system. You can combine that with democracy or communism or fascism.
I really recommend you learn what all these terms mean, because it’s not only super fascinating, but we can each understand and communicate better when we can build upon common concepts.
Words have meanings - if people start calling left-leaning authoritarians “fascists” and no one corrects them, the red-hats will never understand how to differentiate; or why to differentiate.
I’m using the definition of fascism as it relates to dictator advocacy. I know that confuses a lot of people who associate socialism with left and fascism with right, but it is proper use of the term.
The etymology is rooted in Italian authoritarianism from root words meaning a political gathering of men.
Who has defined fascism as such? How do the practices of Stalinism root in Italian authoritarianism?
Defining fascism as any form of authoritarianism broadens the term so much as to render it useless.
It’s useful to be able to talk about the ways in which the ideologies which governed Franco’s Spain and Mussolini’s Italy are more similar to each other than say, something like the DPRK under Juche. If we want to refer to something as authoritarian, we already have the word authoritarian.
The 1930s USSR was squarely under the rule of Joseph Stalin, a brutal dictator. It was a time of mass starvation and persecution.
Yes. And communist, fascist, and dictator mean 3 very different things. I used to think they were synonymous, too, but they’re not.
Communist and fascist are polar opposites. Authoritarian is the extremes of both sides. A dictator can exist at any point in the spectrum, and isn’t unique to any side.
It really does help if we can agree what words mean.
Communist means something different but the USS Fucking R certainly belongs with the other two.
Of course. Many nations have been 2 of the three. But nobody has ever been all 3, because 2 are antithetical to one another.
e: obv the USSR was communist and authoritarian. Who said they weren’t?
Looks like you know your prayers.
“That didn’t happen.
And if it did, it wasn’t that bad.
And if it was, that’s not a big deal.
And if it is, that’s not my fault.
And if it was, I didn’t mean it.
And if I did, you deserved it.”
?
I’m not defending anything. You seem too defensive for this conversation, if that’s what you think. (Judging by you downvoting my comments before you even reply, that’s becoming obvious.)
Can you actually define the words you’re using, even to yourself? Or are you lashing out at me based on what you feel they mean?
I’m willing to talk to you, but only if we can agree upon what words like ‘socialism’ mean. If not, we’ll only talk past each other, and I think you’ll agree that will waste both of our time.
Authoritarian is not fascism. It is a component, but communism and fascism are not even close to synonymous.
There was one famine from mismanagement, and Stalin wasn’t a great guy but this shit is really overblown.
Are you trying to say that authoritarianism is a component of fascism, but fascism isn’t the only type of authoritarianism? 'Cause that’s not super clear from your wording.
Yes
The USSR was a fascism because it was a central dictatorship with violent tendencies. The actual definition of the term.
That’s not the definition of the term, by any ones analysis. The simplest, original definition is that fascism is state and corporate power combined. Like the US has been for half a century.
yunxiaoli, you’ve been made a complete fool of.
Not really, you’re the one that is just taking all 1.67 inches of capitalist dick while trying to redefine fascism away from Mussolini’s definition so you can protect the status quo you have been sold as ‘not perfect but the best we’ve come up with’.
Capitalism and liberalism have always lead to fascism. They are the only ideologies to ever develop into fascism. Socialism and communism, maybe even anarchism are the only future humanity has. Humanity can’t coexist with capitalists long term.
1.67 is really specific, did that number come from anything, or is it just random?
If you truly promoted socialism you would never support the USSR or the CCP.
And if you knew anything about socialism you’d support the cpc. Maybe not the ussr but we’ve learned from their failures.
China is a fully socialist state. If you think otherwise you either stopped paying attention to socialism in the mid 1800s, or you don’t know enough about China.
I think when most people fantasize about socialism they are thinking of Nordic style and not authoritarian CCP style.
My litmus test is the ability to openly criticize your government. In an open and free society this is allowed.
Any authoritarian society, regardless of economic system, is not in the right track. In my opinion. Then again I only consume western media so maybe the CCP isn’t that bad. Can you tell me what happened on June 4th, 1989?
Google is free dude.
Google is evil. Use another search engine instead.
https://european-alternatives.eu/alternative-to/google-search
Authoritarian is the word you’re looking for, not fascist.
I’m surprised the comments seem to be defending authoritarianism like it’s any more acceptable than fascism. “Stalin may have had millions of people killed and fueled the negative reputation of communism world wide for nearly a century, but at least he wasn’t a fascist.”. I don’t seem to understand why democratic social ownership is considered a worse alternative than letting a centralized tyrannical government harm people unchecked.
I’m not defending anything like that, but:
Authoritarian != communism. Authoritarianism applies equally to communism and fascism. The latter two describe ideology, where ‘authoritarian’ describes scale. Your sentence is like if I said I I use reds, not apples, in my pies. It sort of makes sense, but not really.
You said: ‘I don’t seem to understand why democratic social ownership is considered a worse alternative’ yes, exactly! That’s socialism, which is an economic – not a political – system. You can combine that with democracy or communism or fascism.
I really recommend you learn what all these terms mean, because it’s not only super fascinating, but we can each understand and communicate better when we can build upon common concepts.
“shooting a home invader and killing the neighbor next door are both violent killings, so we should classify them both as murder” - you, probably.
Words have meanings - if people start calling left-leaning authoritarians “fascists” and no one corrects them, the red-hats will never understand how to differentiate; or why to differentiate.
I’m using the definition of fascism as it relates to dictator advocacy. I know that confuses a lot of people who associate socialism with left and fascism with right, but it is proper use of the term.
The etymology is rooted in Italian authoritarianism from root words meaning a political gathering of men.
Who has defined fascism as such? How do the practices of Stalinism root in Italian authoritarianism?
Defining fascism as any form of authoritarianism broadens the term so much as to render it useless.
It’s useful to be able to talk about the ways in which the ideologies which governed Franco’s Spain and Mussolini’s Italy are more similar to each other than say, something like the DPRK under Juche. If we want to refer to something as authoritarian, we already have the word authoritarian.
Source?