Some young American workers are moving to Europe in hopes of a healthier and happier life.
25 years I’ve been abroad (The Netherlands) and the work-life balance is why I stayed. They insist I take days off (still foolishly work like an American) and have already booked out a 3 week vacation for later in the year…and I’ll still have nearly 2 weeks of vacation left. We can roll a few weeks of vacation over to the next year if not used. Even though the Dutch have NO holidays from June to Christmas, I’m still able to take 4 day weekends when I want to.
The downside is family left behind may begin to resent you. My family have developed this red-hat victim culture. I can’t bring up how I live abroad or else it starts fights - they don’t want to talk to me now.
Same with the resentment! Lots of people in the US don’t want to hear how much better it is elsewhere. GrEaTesT NaTiOn oN eArTh!
It’s funny, because if you’re living in the US and bringing up topics (like e.g. healthcare, parental leave, vacation time, sick days, the school system, universal access to universities and higher education, traffic deaths, gun violence, etc. etc. etc.) the reaction is often “well, if you hate it so much, why don’t you just leave?”
And then, when you actually leave and live a much more enjoyable and happy life elsewhere, the reaction is “we don’t want to hear about it!!!”
They didn’t want to hear about it in the first place ;)
Sometimes you just have to make the changes you can. For me, it was time to go - I wanted to see more of the world, to work and explore and see life differently. My family wanted something different: solidity, family, planting themselves. I needed to explore. We both got what we needed.
Honestly, EVERY country is doing this. “If you ain’t dutch, you ain’t much” is our ridiculous motto. Pfft.
looks like you should stop talking to that family of yours
Too late. They stopped taking to me.
Conservativism rots the brain. Imagine disowning your own fucking family simply because they moved to a different place. Disgusting.
Sorry to hear that.
I have my family sparsed all over Europe and the world. Just because we are away doesn’t mean we don’t talk with eachother.
Of course my parents would prefer that we were nearby but they understand.
Lifebalance is just as important as money in the end.
Why the resentment though? Is it because they’re thinking that they had it terrible and therefore you should too? That you’re not a loyal worker and therefore less of a person because of that?
Or can it be that they feel left behind and you talking about how great it is to them sounds like you don’t miss them or regret moving away?
Seriously been considering moving the family to the Netherlands or Sweden.
Lived in a few places in Europe over the years. Currently in Canada, which is slowly sliding into being a hellhole like America. 😓
I’ll be retiring soon and move to Asia with the wife. We’ll leave the light on for ya… 👍
Thanks. Where abouts in Asia? Had a friend retire in Singapore and they’ve been loving it.
Jealous! I’d love to be able to move out of the US, but seems you need certain jobs in order to go. Don’t think I qualify, so will continue to be a slave to the system here.
Dunno how old you are, but you can take a loan to study in Europe, get a job, and decide whether you want to pay back the loan or not. If you plan on never returning to the US, then AFAIK, you don’t have to pay back shit and there’s nothing they can do. Although, maybe that changed when the USA started demanding taxes from Americans abroad and forcing banks to close their accounts abroad too… who knows.
Anyway, it’ll probably be cheaper for you to move to Europe.
I’m 33 and have a 1 year old son, I feel like the ship has sailed for me.
You might not know how much you can do. If refugees can travel from Afghanistan all the way to France with their entire family, you can do it from the US. Dunno what you’re doing, but crafts and trades jobs are also understaffed across Europe. Germany is even trying to be attractive to nurses all the way from India!
Don’t underestimate yourself.
If you understand that the high salary is to meet the high cost of living in the United States then you’ll understand that it isn’t a pay cut. Take that one step further and consider the fact that the higher cost of living does NOT come with a higher quality of life in the US.
As an American who has been abroad for many years, can confirm! I’m visiting the states at the moment and its crazy to hear a family member talking about trying to convince their boss that the employees should get five paid sick days a year instead of only three. Three! A year! Insane.
sick days even
Five!!!
insane
What are you supposed to do?
Turn up, shit yourself, keep helping customers?
Or do you turn up, shit yourself, then get fired?
Ok, but what matters is your turned up /s
Last year was super shitty, I had COVID twice and Shingles with nerve pains, I’ve been on sick leave for more than a month over the year, it would have been a disaster without socialized healthcare and workers’ insurance
America becoming a third world country.
Always was
(••) (••)>⌐■-■ (⌐■_■)
If only they would leave their political affiliations and a few bad bits of their culture in the US too, that’d be great. They’re otherwise very welcome here, as is anybody else who wants to embrace the European lifestyle and integrate, Iranian, Afghan, Australian, Kenyan, Brazilian, Turkish, whatever.
Honestly, I moved to Germany two years ago, and I would only go back if my family needed my help in the US. Life feels a lot easier, and more comfortable. Yeah, the winter sucks, but even then I’m outside more than when I lived in the US.
There is no bad weather, just bad clothes.
how are you cold? just put on another layer B)
You must dress like an onion.
I’ve found that that’s actually very true.
What’s wrong with winter?
Since I came from a very dry, hot area, I’m not used to such long winters, weather that cold, and days that short.
as an European I have to say:
please stop advertising this, they will all come here with their American dreams and turn Europe in USA.
I’m yet to see two of them actually connecting the dots between the “American dream” and the horrible labor laws. They want the wellbeing we have but they also want the rampant capitalism, they think “socialism == communism”
American here - this stuff is actually widely known and accepted among our progressives, who are the people most likely by far to leave.
We just get fucked out of political power at the federal level by the outsized representation of small-population, rural, die-hard-conservative states. For example if the presidency was by popular vote we likely wouldn’t have had a Republican president since 93 which would have made the supreme court liberal by 8-1.
At the most fundamental level, the US political system just wasn’t built to handle the increasing rural/urban population disparity, and at some point things will need to change. What that change looks like is anybody’s guess. One scenario is that with the economic failure of the backwaters, plus the housing crisis and additional automation, it becomes economically feasible to just build/buy enough housing in the backwaters to be able to have a controlling share in the vote. Which obviously sucks in a lot of ways but it might be the solution with the lowest barrier to entry.
I wouldn’t worry too much about that. The most reactionary people in the US, those who think socialism is communism and horrible labor laws are “freedom,” are too heavily indoctrinated into their own little death cult. They honestly believe there is no country more free than the US and are genuinely fearful of the idea of living anywhere else, they would never move to Europe.
People who live in reality, on the other hand, see how horrible it has become in the US and are looking for a real “land of opportunity,” where you do not have to be a willing slave to capital in order to have the right to the basic necessities of life. They are fully disillusioned with the “American dream,” and so are more open-minded toward socialism, and are more willing to agree that maybe most countries in Europe provide them with real, actual freedom far more that what they have living in the US.
This has been my experience with immigrants from the US, anyways (and, full disclosure, I am an immigrant as well, just not in Europe).
Clumping 332 million people together and expecting that they’re all the exact same.
Come on, buddy.
That’s a weird take on the subject, most American I’ve met or worked with where surprised but happy about our ways.
We might have met totally different kinds of people.
I’d do it if I could afford it or was younger. Honestly wish I had. The sacrifice now, with family and kids, is too massive.
You can get a new family and kids! Or bring em I guess
IDK, does the salary deficit makes up for it?
Depends entirely on your values and perspective
If you’re coming from the upper echelons of US income then it might not.
Otherwise you’ll potentially find the increase in quality of life to be significant.
Americans work too much, commute to much and don’t take enough holidays. Europeans work significantly less hours day to day, have significantly shorter commutes on average and have legally required and protected minimum annual leave that vastly outstrips US workers.
E.g. Take myself and a US friend in a very similar job into account. Yes he earns roughly double what I do.
- However I average 10-15 hours less work a week than he does.
- My commute is half what his is and I have actual public transport options that aren’t trash if my car broke down.
- I get 38 days of paid leave a year. 8 national holidays and the time between Christmas and Jan 1st by default… That leaves me with 27 days to use with some degree of freedom. He’s lucky if he takes ten days total per year.
- I get private healthcare but also know that if that was removed from my benefits I’d have access to state healthcare without the risk of bankruptcy.
Those listed things are just employment based. Culture is also a factor. I’ve never once worried about being shot in my entire life. Our food quality standards are higher whilst also costing significantly less. We don’t have the institutionalised national self delusion of tipping culture. Our religious and crazy right wing aren’t politically powerful enough to be dragging us kicking and screaming inti the 18th century like the US is. We aren’t completely and utterly dependent on cars, so being car free is a viable way to live.
My final note is this. I’m not some US hating zealot. I literally booked flights for a two week holiday in the US yesterday. I adore the NBA and find American people to be absolutely lovely on average. But I couldn’t live the way most Americans do.
look at it this way, necessities in USA are largely out of reach (health care, education, housing, funded retirement) and luxaries are easy to come by (phones, sneakers, branded clothing, streaming etc).
Whereas in Europe, the necessities are much more attainable for the population at any income bracket. Do you have much more “free cash”? No. Do you need it? No, you have a social safety net.
Even vacas in Europe are cheaper bc for an American to travel to Europe is very expensive by means of airplane. In Europe you can take a high speed train and be in any climate.
On the topic of trains, Public transit is more efficient there than it is to drive cars in the states. Imagine not having to buy a ~$30k car every 10 years? Not to mention fuel and maintain it.
Without an atom of doubt. I’ve experienced both, and I will make the choice of paycut again a hundred times if I had to choose again.
I cannot speak to what working in Europe is like, but as someone who works in the public sector in a very blue state, the work/life balance and benefits are unmatched. Yes, the pay is slightly less, but it is more than worth it imo if it means I only have to work 4 days and 35 hours a week, and not 6 days and 70 hours a week.
Coders in the US can make six figures easy. In Spain it’s like 20-40k, 60kish un Luxembourg if you’re a specialist and got a masters degree, etc. I’ve looked at the tech jobs in Europe in general and I’m unimpressed.
Rookie mistake is to look for coding jobs in Luxembourg, you earn 68k as a elementary school teacher
Wages in general are much better in the US. But then expenses also tend to be higher, not only health, even the tipping gets crazy expensive. But in the end it’s very personal, what makes you happy? Is it money? Being close to family? Being in your own country? For most people the move would be too troublesome to be worth it, I guess.
A lady I work with in the Netherlands sent me an email Friday. I responded and got an OOTO message saying she’s out till 7/31
Definitely jealous
Damn, isn’t 8 years a bit much?
I’m in Asia and receive OOTO emails all the time, meanwhile we work even during holidays 🙃. A co worker is a Chilean, and during her 3 weeks leave to go back home after years of not taking any leave, she worked day and night, slept only 3 hours the whole stay. We Asians were successfully brainwashed into the hustle culture
It’s a thing I like about Germans. They tend to be more strict about working hours than other EU countries, let alone somewhere like America.
I worked in the Netherlands for a while, and we’d get loads of German visitors. When we were nearing closing time, we’d often have German visitors going “It’s his ‘Feierabend’(end of day). He can’t help you anymore”. Especially when they had a problem that would last till after closing time to solve. And then when you told them “no, no. It’s fine.” they were genuinely grateful. They didn’t expect you to work, when you were no longer being paid to.
You shift starts. You work. Your shift ends. You are no longer working.
The unsurprising result: experts often say German workers outperform American workers. Turns out strictly enforcing working hours, allowing workers to recuperate when they’re not on shift, means they end up working harder when they are on shift.
I worked for the US division of a German company and found that the culture even for the US workers was very respectful of time off and appropriate working hours. I hated the job because I was customer facing and our customers were typically large US companies, but the German company was a great company to work for.
Muss gerade an diesen Bericht von kürzlich denken, ebenfalls vom glorreichen Business Insider:
https://www.businessinsider.com/us-germany-relocation-american-move-disappointing-2023-6
Lustiger Kontrast.
Was für ein dämlicher Artikel. Wäh, wäh, ich wohne in einem kleinen Dorf und habe nicht Zugang zu allen Modern conveniences wie in einer grossen Stadt. Wäääh… Echt, jetzt?
Mein Highlight war dass sie einen schlechten job hat bei dem sie in einer schwachen Währung Geld verdient aber Deutschland ist teuer.
Haha genau das habe ich beim lesen gedacht. “Warum hilft mir denn keiner? Ich vermisse Walmart!” lol
Moving abroad is always challenging and not for everyone, some people can’t adapt to a different way of life.
Generell lustiger Artikel, danke.
“We live in a small German town called Otterberg” had me laughing out loud.
I was wondering where she could be living - maybe Munich or some other city in Bavaria, where people are not exactly known for warming up easily on foreigners (read: people from more than 20 minutes away). But no - she’s living in Otterberg. Hilarious.
If I had the money, I’d be running for Europe right now. America has gone to shit and it is only going to get worse from here
The paperwork and logistics is going to be a bitch, but if you can start looking for a job in Europe from your current location, the move itself might be less expansive than you expect.
See, that’s the thing. I’m in film and my goal is to parlay this work into a work visa in Europe for this exact reason. I love my work, but I want benefits and protections that just aren’t afforded me here (because my particular Union in my area is problematic as fuck, not to mention hard to break into). But my concern is how this even gets done.
The US has made it very difficult for citizens of other countries to get paperwork to live and work here, so we see a lot of reciprocation in level of difficulty to leave this place. I wish I could get someone to give me some info on the process that’s been through it
Be aware that a lot of US studios love to shoot in Germany, because our unions in the film business are non existent and they can shoot longer and pay less in Germany.
Don’t worry. It’s also going to shit on this side of the pond.
My boyfriend only has a year left of nursing school. With so many countries having a shortage, we are thinking that might help us. Like apperantly in Japan they have a program to get people in for nursing and you can buy a house for cheap. But I’m not sure if I want to love in Japan. About 3-4 months ago I actually had some people from Australia on reddit giving me a lot of good info to help us get over there, and one person was talking to me about New Zealand.
So here’s to hoping. I’m gonna miss my family and friends. It’s gonna be hard, but I’m tired of this place.
When America sends its people, they’re not sending their best.
Those damn lazy immigrants only want to exploit us! We can’t accomodate them all!
(I hope it’s clear that this is a joke)
I’m bitter because I was never well off enough to escape to Europe. Best I could do is maliciously complying with USA capitalism and becoming an anti-consumer
I went as a student (free university!) and managed to stay.
