In the past I have only seen PayPal spontaneously demand at arbitrary/unexpected moments that I jump their their hoops – to login and give them more info about me. I reluctantly did what they wanted, and they kept my account frozen and kept my money anyway. So I’ve been boycotting PayPal ever since. Not worth it for to work hard to find out why they kept my account frozen and to work hard to twist their arm to so that I can give them my business. Now an actual financial institution is trying something similar. They are not as hostile as PayPal was (they did not pre-emptively freeze my account until I dance for them), but they sent an email demanding that I login and update my employment information (even though it has not changed). Presumably they will eventually freeze my account if I do not dance for them to satisfy their spontaneous demand. I just wonder how many FIs are pulling this shit. And what are people doing about it? Normally I would walk… pull my money out and go elsewhere. But the FI that is pushing KYC harassment has a lot of power because they offer some features I need that I cannot get elsewhere, and I have some stocks through them, which makes it costly/non-trivial to bounce. I feel like we should be keeping a public database on FIs who pull this shit, so new customers can be made aware of who to avoid.

(cross-posting is broken on links.hackliberty.org, so the following is manually copied from the original post)

When your bank/CU/brokerage demands that you login to their portal to update KYC info soloActivist to Privacy@fedia.io ·

In the past I have only seen PayPal spontaneously demand at arbitrary/unexpected moments that I jump their their hoops – to login and give them more info about me. I reluctantly did what they wanted, and they kept my account frozen and kept my money anyway.

So I’ve been boycotting PayPal ever since. Not worth it for to work hard to find out why they kept my account frozen and to work hard to twist their arm to so that I can give them my business.

Now an actual financial institution is trying something similar. They are not as hostile as PayPal was (they did not pre-emptively freeze my account until I dance for them), but they sent an email demanding that I login and update my employment information (even though it has not changed). Presumably they will eventually freeze my account if I do not dance for them to satisfy their spontaneous demand.

I just wonder how many FIs are pulling this shit. And what are people doing about it? Normally I would walk… pull my money out and go elsewhere. But the FI that is pushing KYC harassment has a lot of power because they offer some features I need that I cannot get elsewhere, and I have some stocks through them, which makes it costly/non-trivial to bounce.

I feel like we should be keeping a public database on FIs who pull this shit, so new customers can be made aware of who to avoid.

  • TechNerdWizard42@lemmy.world
    21·
    3 days ago

    Here’s the thing. It’s every bank that is on the SWIFT network because the US is a terroristic state when it comes to financial spying, sorry “transparency”.

    Demanding KYC and reporting all your transactions via SARs is the standard thing for all banks. The only ones that get away with not having to do it are the manipulative criminals who schmooze there way in with tellers and do transactions that way. But that’s also stopping with the crackdown at large.

    I keep accounts in the US, but I have moved as much as I can out. If you’re in the position where you’ve got high 5 figures or more it may be worth it to setup accounts outside the USA in countries that are hostile to the US banking system. If you are in the position where you can drop $250k on a new citizenship, then get it. Then open accounts under that passport in countries that don’t comply with the US.

    Otherwise, you’re screwed. This is why crypto and BRICs are a big thing.

    • soloActivist@links.hackliberty.orgOP
      2·
      3 days ago

      Sounds mostly reasonable… but I don’t see the alternate citizenship helping, unless you mean to go as far as renouncing because all FATCA regions (~130+ countries) look at the birthplace, not nationality, and you can never get a new birthplace. It’s probably hard to find a non-FATCA region where you can trust the banks. But indeed… getting your 4th amendment rights has come to extremes.

      • TechNerdWizard42@lemmy.world
        1·
        3 days ago

        I have many citizenships, one specifically for banking. They look at your birthplace but really it’s your passport. They are required to report US citizens, which are passport holders (because you’re outside the US). Having a second passport or third or whatever, doesn’t bring it up. You must falsely claim you are not an American in friendly countries and then you’re fine. They are very aware of renunciation and don’t require proof. The proof of a secondary passport as your primary is all that’s needed. For example you entered the country on your other passport, that’s where your visa is tied to etc.

        The other way with unfriendly countries is even easier. For example if you open a TBank account in Russia, it takes about a day online and they courier you your debit card and bank documents to your hotel. So it requires 2 days in Russia. Even as a US citizen, on a US passport, they do not comply with FACTA. Your accounts and transactions will never be sent to the USA.

        You as an American must still report those assets on your taxes. So again, choose whether you want privacy or being a “white collar criminal”