Yeah your right, context matters. It’s okay to shit on gusanos. I was a war refugee, and I can’t stand westernized people from my country—they’re a pain to be around.
oh im fully down with shiting on gusanos im married to the biggest gusano hater of them all, when we last had to go to maimi you could see the viseral disgust roiling off of him the whole time.
Without going too overboard and also attempting to maintain a general viewpoint that everyone is a human, even the descendants of oppressors:
I would say I agree with what you said, but applied to actually displaced people. Also, it’s hard to apply “displaced” to people based solely on nationality (or former-nationality). Cuban is just a nationality, no matter how much people try their hardest to make it an ethnicity unto its own (not saying you’re doing this, but it is a commonly done thing.) It’s like trying to act like “American” (as in USAian) is an ethnicity. There’s a diversity of Cubans (and Cuban Americans) just as there is for USAians.
For example: Palestinian refugees remain Palestinian no matter how many generations go by and they will always be a displaced people unless they’re able to return to their land and homes. This also applies to other various indigenous groups such as indigenous/native Americans, indigenous/aboriginal people in Australia, etc.
The key thing there is they are indigenous to the lands they or their family before they were born were forced to flee.
However, say Palestine is legally formed by the UN and the entire land between the river and sea becomes the Palestinian state. Israel is dissolved. All Israelis who choose to stay are given instant citizenship… but some refuse this, declare that the state is illegitimate, etc. and pack their shit and leave. They spend the next 60 years crying endlessly about how Palestinians victimized them. That THEY are somehow the wronged party.
That’s a pretty direct comparison to the “fled from Fidel” Cuban-American population. They didn’t have to leave. Most of them anyway. They were just reactionary scum that couldn’t stomach their slaves and plantations being taken.
Now obviously this is slightly complicated by the fact that the US offered instant green cards and fast tracked citizenship to Cuban “refugees” and due to the endless embargo Cuba did have some times that people felt compelled to flee the island. Not all of them did so because of a deeply held love of capitalism or whatever.
But my point is… why are they displaced? Because of the actions of a mixture of their family, the US government, and maybe personal choice (first generation). Not the fault of Cuba except for the ones fleeing justice… in which case, absolutely fuck them.
Why are Palestinians and other indigenous people displaced? 100% because of the oppressors and their backers. There is no fault to lay on the first generation refugees unlike with Cubans or my hypothetical Israeli refugees.
Is the fault inherited? That doesn’t seem fair. So, no. But are they displaced? Were they ever “displaced?” I’d argue a firm… no. I already laid out the caveat for actual economic immigrants (again, caused by the US, but I wouldn’t necessarily fault them for not knowing that)
I guess the point is a lot of people aren’t displaced and their family wasn’t unfairly wronged. Maybe they believe they were. That’s fine. But I’m not going to go along with the delusions of some grandkid of a Bay of Pigs veteran and act like their grandfather, them, or anyone in their family was wronged by Cuba. Experiencing justice, as this hypothetical but also very real person experienced, isn’t “being wronged.” The party who did wrong and faced accountability may feel wronged. But that doesn’t mean they were or that we should cater to their bad and wrong opinions of their experiences (or more commonly now days, the experiences of their parents or grandparents). Kinda like if a grandkid of a Nazi complained that the Soviets shot grandpa. “Ok, and?” Yes that probably sucked for his family. Doesn’t mean we need to consider the family victims.
I hope this didn’t go too crazy, and I’m not saying every Cuban-American is a right wing chud asshole. People should treat people as people. But if someone legitimately believes they were wronged or displaced, I’m not going to just surrender that when there are people who are actually displaced and were and still are being wronged. I’m not going to sympathize the same with the grandkid of a “killed in action” Nazi soldier the same as I would the grandkid of a Holocaust victim. Blame isn’t inherited, but the actions of your ancestors does disqualify you from certain claims and certain types of sympathy… from me anyway.
They took my grandpa’s slaves!
Cry about it.
not a good idea to spread, consider how a actully displaced person may feel.
Yeah your right, context matters. It’s okay to shit on gusanos. I was a war refugee, and I can’t stand westernized people from my country—they’re a pain to be around.
oh im fully down with shiting on gusanos im married to the biggest gusano hater of them all, when we last had to go to maimi you could see the viseral disgust roiling off of him the whole time.
tbh the big man was probably a bit too kind to them… can’t really fault him for having too much humanity though
omg I’m so jealous, tom is dreamy
lol no no mine is much cuter. edit ok i googled “tom morello young” and wow he did used to be cute.
FOr me its young Zach de la Rocha
Right?? He’s got that dad bod now, but he’s still a catch.
if he wasn’t twice my age plus a decade id go for it yeah!
omg I’m so jealous, Zack is dreamy
Without going too overboard and also attempting to maintain a general viewpoint that everyone is a human, even the descendants of oppressors:
I would say I agree with what you said, but applied to actually displaced people. Also, it’s hard to apply “displaced” to people based solely on nationality (or former-nationality). Cuban is just a nationality, no matter how much people try their hardest to make it an ethnicity unto its own (not saying you’re doing this, but it is a commonly done thing.) It’s like trying to act like “American” (as in USAian) is an ethnicity. There’s a diversity of Cubans (and Cuban Americans) just as there is for USAians.
For example: Palestinian refugees remain Palestinian no matter how many generations go by and they will always be a displaced people unless they’re able to return to their land and homes. This also applies to other various indigenous groups such as indigenous/native Americans, indigenous/aboriginal people in Australia, etc.
The key thing there is they are indigenous to the lands they or their family before they were born were forced to flee.
However, say Palestine is legally formed by the UN and the entire land between the river and sea becomes the Palestinian state. Israel is dissolved. All Israelis who choose to stay are given instant citizenship… but some refuse this, declare that the state is illegitimate, etc. and pack their shit and leave. They spend the next 60 years crying endlessly about how Palestinians victimized them. That THEY are somehow the wronged party.
That’s a pretty direct comparison to the “fled from Fidel” Cuban-American population. They didn’t have to leave. Most of them anyway. They were just reactionary scum that couldn’t stomach their slaves and plantations being taken.
Now obviously this is slightly complicated by the fact that the US offered instant green cards and fast tracked citizenship to Cuban “refugees” and due to the endless embargo Cuba did have some times that people felt compelled to flee the island. Not all of them did so because of a deeply held love of capitalism or whatever.
But my point is… why are they displaced? Because of the actions of a mixture of their family, the US government, and maybe personal choice (first generation). Not the fault of Cuba except for the ones fleeing justice… in which case, absolutely fuck them.
Why are Palestinians and other indigenous people displaced? 100% because of the oppressors and their backers. There is no fault to lay on the first generation refugees unlike with Cubans or my hypothetical Israeli refugees.
Is the fault inherited? That doesn’t seem fair. So, no. But are they displaced? Were they ever “displaced?” I’d argue a firm… no. I already laid out the caveat for actual economic immigrants (again, caused by the US, but I wouldn’t necessarily fault them for not knowing that)
I guess the point is a lot of people aren’t displaced and their family wasn’t unfairly wronged. Maybe they believe they were. That’s fine. But I’m not going to go along with the delusions of some grandkid of a Bay of Pigs veteran and act like their grandfather, them, or anyone in their family was wronged by Cuba. Experiencing justice, as this hypothetical but also very real person experienced, isn’t “being wronged.” The party who did wrong and faced accountability may feel wronged. But that doesn’t mean they were or that we should cater to their bad and wrong opinions of their experiences (or more commonly now days, the experiences of their parents or grandparents). Kinda like if a grandkid of a Nazi complained that the Soviets shot grandpa. “Ok, and?” Yes that probably sucked for his family. Doesn’t mean we need to consider the family victims.
I hope this didn’t go too crazy, and I’m not saying every Cuban-American is a right wing chud asshole. People should treat people as people. But if someone legitimately believes they were wronged or displaced, I’m not going to just surrender that when there are people who are actually displaced and were and still are being wronged. I’m not going to sympathize the same with the grandkid of a “killed in action” Nazi soldier the same as I would the grandkid of a Holocaust victim. Blame isn’t inherited, but the actions of your ancestors does disqualify you from certain claims and certain types of sympathy… from me anyway.