when Russia becomes the third world nation in a proxy war.
Russia has been a third world nation since the collapse of the Soviet Union. Politicians just like to use the Russian boogeyman to scare people who remember the Cold War. Putin may be a monster, but China is the real threat.
Russia literally invaded two countries and stole their land and people. Your post is ridiculous.
Russia is certainly a regional threat but countries invade and dominate other countries in their sphere of influence all the time. Russia does not have what it takes to dominate on a world stage like they did after World War 2. Their economy is weak, as is their military.
Do Abkhazians and Ossetians really count themselves stolen Georgian citizens? Do they really count their land as Georgian land stolen by Russians? Your post is ridiculous.
😭
Okay lol
I understand your sentiment but as a history major I need to clarify that Russia is literally the Second World Nation. As in, the First, Second, and Third categorization emerged to describe pro-NATO, pro-Warsaw Pact, and unaligned countries.
TIL…
China was considered a true partner of the West until 2008.
Business was good, fake news was doing daddies’ biddings while jobs were being shipped out.
Both the US and China have legitimate security interests that are at odds with each other.
Sorry, but the real threat to what exactly?
Edited: aside from Taiwan, Hong Kong, several other nations in the east. My question was more in the context of China as a threat to anything in the western hemisphere. They are the eastern version of the US, no doubt about it.
The US status as a hegemony.
With India on the rise as well I think we are transitioning into a pre-WW1 like multipolar balance of power which could slide into WW3. Safest option would be China and the US dominate everyone else and we get another Cold War, but we will see.
the least racist redditor on lemmy
I’m losing the plot. I don’t know what’s real anymore. Liberal confusion is bloody contagious.
"usa good china bad
ww3 great"
What does race have to do with it?
Oh please, we all know the real reason China is seen as a “threat” by Americans.
It’s all about money and power, mate. Not race. The US and the Soviet Union are both predominately Caucasian and they were at odds for the better part of the 20th Century. Race has nothing to do with it.
When it comes to China, racism isn’t exactly hidden.
What are you on about? You didn’t address my counter-point. You merely restated this blatant propaganda.
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but
ChinaAmerica is the real threat.FTFY
Why not both?
I guess everything is relative. I should have clarified that I meant China is a threat to America’s dominance of the world stage.
I have no problem with that.
Yeah to be fair some people will have a problem with it and some won’t. I think it will be interesting to see who comes out on top.
My money is on the Chinese.
Maybe, but the housing crisis and shrinking population gives me pause. Not to mention I think there is more internal dissent in China than people like to talk about. China still hasn’t caught up to the US militarily and the gap is no longer closing in.
America collaborates well enough with the rest od the countries. Americas system is bullshit but China is having even more control and is even more destructive. Both are shit but China is more of a threat
More of a threat to who?
Collaborate? Is that what America does when they invade a country and murder its people?
I think it’s the bit where they install a military outpost and destroy the host’s energy infrastructure.
No no no, they liberate the country from dangerous potential socialist values, a perceived will of the country to distance themselves from the US, or, you know, because they can.
Thats why I hate america too, and its capitalist system. They are mostly jerks. But they chrisitan way of not knowing what to do except of bombarding is really weird.
But at least its cooperating eith EU and some counctries.
The only people that matter are white and European.
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Just an endless slew of clickbait “China bad” headlines all the time. Really makes you wonder about if there is some sort of systemic problem with western media.
It is called propaganda
Be careful, saying something like that might get you called a wumao
me casually just responding to NAFOids that I get paid 50CNY an hour to :anti-cracker-aktion:
If you want to see consent being manufactured, go into the Telegraph and click through to the journalist’s
post historyarticle historyIt’s going to be hilarious in a year or so when we’ll have LLM bots churning these types of articles out even at respected news outlets, and all critics of this narrative will still get smeared as being bots themselves
Authoritarian countries tend to be criticised in liberal western democracies, you know, because of all of the authoritarianism.
Everyone is a little bit authoritarian. It’s the intent and end result that gives it meaning. You don’t see France being criticised these days do you despite their citizenry being vocal about their regime’s mismanagement. We’ve even seemingly had a Western media blackout effectively on it for the past month (they’ve had riots/protests).
When was the last time France massacred protestors by using tanks to turn them into red paste?
When was the last time France rounded up its citzens based on ethbicity and religion and put them into reeducation camps?
Western media blackout? Maybe in your bubble mate, though I tend to follow these things deliberately so I’m not best placed to say. Western media is a joke regardless - owned and controlled by a few wealthy and powerful individuals, who sadly almost all hold similar politics beliefs.
How much control do you really have over a government that only has two parties? FPTP is a failure. It leaves government without accountability, pisses on the principle of equal representation, and shifts power towards the few areas that may actually flip.
If you lose this federal election, so what? Eventually, people will get angry enough at the current ruling party to flip.
If you vote, so what? Unless you’re in a swing state, your vote might as well not exist for the presidential election.
What about representation in the house? Well, again, your vote doesn’t really matter unless you’re in a swing district (which tends to be suburban). If you’re urban (liberal) or rural (conservative), you might as well not vote either.
Name one country that’s not authoritarian
Lol all states are bad. “China” as a concept can barely represent the true diversity of the people living in that across and around that huge chunk of land, as much as “USA” can barely represent each individual there.
Of course it’s hexbears again, fucking cancer
All he did was make a comment you are already whining
Stop whining mate.
emoji
winingNo selfawareness
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Thank you for your valuable comment
Thank YOU for your waste of oxygen.
deep breaths, you’ve got this
Uh oh someone sounds upset
Stop you’re scaring him!
All these reaction images make you seem mentally deranged.
Back in the short bus, come on.
taking the opportunity to make fun of disabled kids isnt it
No, just him.
Bunny!
😠
Oh baby, are you alright? You need a little lie down?
what is federation?
😘
Upsetti?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ad_hominem
Better hexbars than you.
welcome to federation, enjoy your stay
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being some poor idiot
You ever consider that us poor idiots might disagree on what makes a country bad? Get real you chauvinist clown.
experiencing the world through propaganda
Hypocrite, you’re projecting so hard I’m surprised your back hasn’t blown out.
Whaaat? But China said they weren’t doing that. China wouldn’t just lie like that, would it?
Did you check behind their back to see if their fingers were crossed?
No :(
Where have you been when China lied for the 48352847285627th time this week? 🥲
Around I guess, but I was utilizing the technique of sarcasm there.
And I tried to reference the club penguin meme. I suck at being funny.
Well, shit. Comedy is hard, don’t beat yourself up.
Both Russia and Ukraine are buying and using consumer-level drones and scopes from China, though…
Turns out, AliExpress is pretty fucking amazing.
Eh, sometimes it is.
Yes, if you go to aliexpress, you could buy Chinese made helicopter, drones and metals. Thank you the telegraph for the basic info
If you search for certain military equipment, you’ll often see reviews from Russian soldiers and Ukrainian soldiers right next to each other lol
Like, the yank was so mad at Ukrainian keep using Chinese drone, that they force them to stop buying it and use their expensive drone.
The Pentagon is mad that Congress forced them to stop buying Chinese drones. Apparently there are no available replacements in some categories and even where there are, they are many times more expensive.
Rural communities have been using Huawei equipment for internet because it’s cheap and fast. The federal government became upset and demanded they rip everything and replace it with American parts. I think it costs like $12 billion, but the US didn’t even give the communities 50% of the required amount to switch over
Sounds about right for US infrastructure.
australia doing the same shit
Banned from tendering in the National Broadband Network in 2012, banned from participating in the 5G network in 2018, called for removal of surveillance/security cameras in 2018, funded undersea cables in the pacific to block Huawei in 2018, purchased Digicel to prevent Chinese involvement in 2021
US, UK, CAN & AU, 5eyes has been frothing over this for a while
The $2.1 billion deal to acquire and run Digicel Pacific is being funded largely by the government, which will provide $1.9 billion toward the acquisition.
Telstra said it would contribute $360 million and own 100 per cent of the company’s ordinary equity.
“Australian officials were concerned about whether a Chinese company or potentially a Chinese state-owned entity might look to buy Digicel’s Pacific arm and there were some geopolitical and geostrategic concerns about a Chinese company owning a major telecommunication company in the Pacific region, which is of course so close to Australia,” said Amanda Watson, an expert in Pacific communications at the Australian National University.
That’s especially since Digicel Pacific uses a 4,700km undersea cable from Sydney that was largely funded by the Australian government in 2018 in an effort to prevent PNG and the Solomon Islands from contracting Huawei for the project.
Ahh my bad, that was 3 years earlier instead
Somehow on my phone in :estonia-burning: I can access RT and came across this article where the US was coping at South Africa to abandon it’s partnerships with Huawei because “you need to use :lmayo::amerikkka: technologies”. Anyways, South Africa told :amerikkka: to :PIGPOOPBALLS:
Africa: “W-“
US, in Africa: “GYNA!!! GYNA!!! GYNNNNAAAAAAHHHH!!!
”
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I love watching Congress fuck over the Pentagon. Just the worst people in the world slapfighting over fake money. Probably a bad idea to let hundreds of lead huffing jet ski dealers whose only qualification is buying more TV add time than their opponents run a global empire.
My favorite instance of this was the US Army begging congress not to buy more Abrams tanks because they were already too expensive to maintain but congress overruling them and ordering them to buy more to keep the factories open.
"Please, whatver you do just don’t make us-
"-Buy more Abrams, great idea, yes!"Abrams printer go brrrrrrr
99% of the resistance to doing anything good is because the current bad thing provides jobs for like 500,000 people and no one wants to make an effort to help those people
Just like the coal industry.
That’s gotta be in some cyberpunk book somewhere. Especially if they start giving different ratings to the equipment and flaming each other over it.
China: sends Russia six helicopters (before the war), some children’s toys, a box of consumer-grade hunting scopes, and metal. They are the bad guys who are prolonging the war.
NATO: sends Ukraine weapons and military vehicles worth more than China’s entire military budget, and provides training and logistics support. They are the good guys trying to end the war.
The liberals only read the titles and then come straight to the comment sections so they don’t actually realise any of this unless you spell it out for them.
Who attacked who again?
Does your definition of “attack” include locking people in a church and burning them alive? How about sponsoring Neo-Nazi paramilitaries to murder and rape people for seaking a language? Shelling cities and civilians in defiance of international cease fire treaties?
I don’t mean to get in an argument, because that isn’t at all productive.
I wonder though - if Russia hadn’t illegally occupied Ukraine/Crimea, would that have happened?
I wonder though - if Russia hadn’t illegally occupied Ukraine/Crimea, would that have happened?
If Ukrainian neo-Nazis hadn’t trapped ethnic Russians in a building and burned them alive, would Russia have invaded?
My point is: there are no good guys in this conflict. Just two bad guys duking it out, with regular schmucks like you and me getting murdered for no reason. Anything that prolongs the conflict is bad.
For the record - I agree that burning people alive in a building is bad, and war should be avoided if possible.
You didn’t really answer my question though. Why do the resistance groups exist in the first place?
We’ve got a document that lays out the timeline in some detail, but I can’t find it right now.
The short version is that this is a continuation of a very, very long conflict between the western powers and Russia for control of Russia’s resources. Like in a broad sense this geopolitical conflict as been going on for hundreds of years - Europe and now the USA want access to Russia’s resources and to do that they have to get rid of the government currently in charge of Russia. In the past this was all kinds of great power bullshit, Napoleon’s attempt to invade Moscow. Then it was the Russian civil war, where all the Western powers invaded Russia to try to stop the Reds, then WWII when the Nazis and their allies wanted to conquer everything east of them, exterminate or enslave the Slavs, and do Westward Expansion 2.0: Eastward Edition. Then the Cold War, where NATO was formed to counter and eventually destroy the Eastern Block. Well, 1991 happened, the USSR was destroyed, A few coups and murders and the shock doctrine ensured that the capitalists could loot everything, but ultimately the West didn’t get the complete control of Russian territory and resources they wanted. Too many former Soviet Oligarchs and gangsters got in the way and control of the region stayed more or less in local hands - Russian Oligarchs in Russia, Ukrainian Oligarchs in Ukraine, and so on. NATO didn’t disband after 1991, and didn’t let Russia join when Putin tried a few times,because NATO’s purpose is conquest of Russia and they hadn’t pulled that off yet. NATO started annexing countries and moving it’s borders towards Russia, forward positioning troops and weapons, and gradually encircling Russia on it’s populous Western borders. When NATO started talking about moving in to Georgia the Russian’s responded, invaded Georgia, and put an end to that. At some point later NATO decided to move on Ukraine, take control, and use it as a proxy to weaken Russia. They used the same tactic by supporting the Islamists in Afghanistan decades prior, and they’d used it in the middle east and few other places. The basic program is - destabilize a country, flood it with weapons, then let their neighbors bleed themselves dry trying to contain the insurgency. In pursuit of this NATO deployed a bunch of Ukrainian Nazis they’d saved after WWII for exactly this purpose and were gradually able to expand their influence in the country. 2013, the President of Ukraine doesn’t want to sign a shitty deal with Europe both because it would fuck over Ukraine and it would fuck over Ukraine’s trade with Russia, and the Nazis, almost entirely headquartered in Western Ukraine, use this as an excuse to take control of popular unrest and stage a coup. It gets nasty, Ukrainian Nationalists burn a bunch of Russian speaking Ukrainians to death, they throw the president out, the new coup government immediately passes laws making the previously legal Russian language illegal. Out East in the regions where most Ukrainians speak Russian, they see a bunch of Nazis who want them exterminated couping the government, they see the new coup government passing laws against their language, they say “Fuck this, we know what comes next” and take up arms demanding that Kiev grant them autonomy - some government autonomy, guarantees on their right to speak their language and protect their culture, basic shit. Kiev says no, tries to send the army in to Donbass to crush them, the army tells Kiev “Fuck you”. Kiev isn’t giving up so they arm all the Nazis and send them in to Donbass and they start murdering people. This turns in to a civil war. During the civil war NATO moves in. They start re-structuring, training, and arming the Ukrainian military loyal to Kiev. They stockpile all kinds of weapons and shit. The Nazis are rotating back from the front lines with combat experience and are getting integrated in to army units while their civilian Nazi counterparts are getting more and more control over western Ukraine’s government, civic institutions, and culture. This goes on for years, Ukrainians kill thousands of Ukrainians. Meanwhile Russia, who doesn’t want any of this shit happening in their neighborhood, is trying to get some kind of peace negotiations going to stop the conflict and stabilize Ukraine before it falls apart and turns in to a failed state. Well, Ukraine and a bunch of NATO goverments say yes, we’ll talk, lets resolve this, then the Ukrainian Nazis break all the ceasefires and shitcan the peace talks. Happens twice, the accords were called Minsk I and Minsk II. We later find out that Germany and France, who were acting as restaurants of the peace talks, never had any intention of fulfilling the peace conditions and were just buying time to arm Ukraine. Eventually it’s 2020 or something. Ukrainians are sick of this, they don’t want to be at war with their own countrymen, they don’t want to get dragged in to war with Russia because of Nazi psychos, so they vote for Zelensky. Zelensky’s a very charismatic guy, well known from television, speaks Ukrainian and Russia. He runs on a peace platform, says he’s going to uphold the cease fire and start negotiations. Well, once he takes office he goes out to the front and tells the guys at the front to shot shelling Donbass. The guys who are running the Front are Nazi fanatics, they tell him he’s not in charge and he can go fuck himself and they keep shelling. So now Zelensky knows how Ukraine really works, he starts working with NATO and the Nationalists as basically a cheer-leader for Kiev and Galacia’s agenda. Doesn’t really have any power but he looks good on TV. This whole thing finally comes to a head when someone decides that the Ukrainian army, with all it’s NATO training and equipment and guns and NATO provided Nazis, is ready to go crush Donbass. There’s a big build-up - Ukraine is mobilizing it’s army to go in to the east of the country and fight the Donbass republics plus whatever Specops guys Russia has sent in there. Russia is mobilizing part of it’s army at the Ukrainian border and making threatening noises.
Now, it’s February of 2022. Russia has it’s troops on Ukraine’s border. Ukrainian troops are moving East in to Donbass. Putin is making threatening noises, but no one thinks he’ll actually pull the trigger and cross the border. Well, for whatever reason, and it’s still unclear what he was thinking, he pulls the trigger. He claims that he’s doing it to protect Russian speaking Ukrainians from the Banderite Nazis who intend to genocide them (probably in the driving them from their homes sense rather than the extermination of all men, women, and children sense but who knows with Nazis?). That might even be true. But other reasons are that he was finally sick of putting up with NATOs bullshit after decades of post-cold-war hostility, or he had a bad understanding of the situation and thought he could win a decisive victory with that swift attack on Kiev, or maybe he thought people in Ukraine were more angry with their government than they were and would demand some kind of end of hostilities? Who knows, high level commanders and presidents aren’t always very bright and aren’t always getting good intel. Whatever happened, Russia made us all look like idiots by invading (pretty much no one, including me, thought he’d actually do it), and now there was a hot war between NATO forces and Russian forces, except everyone inside NATO pretends that it’s between Ukraine and Russia.
So, that’s the very, very, very short, basically no details, rough sketch version of what lead up to the war. I didn’t even mention stuff like the activities of Ukrainian Nazis in Canada and the US, or all of Russia’s security concerns, or the weird fucked up relationship between the Russiand government and the US government, or how Russia didn’t really invade Crimea because the entire Russian Black Sea Fleet and tons of support personnel were already stationed in Crimea so they really just changed the flags, or the role of propaganda in NATOs decisions on which weapons to send and which weapons to withhold, or what Trump’s trade war bullshit likely had to do with all this, or a trillion other things.
Suffice to say, there’s a lot of history behind this conflict. And since it’s very unlikely either side will definitively win there will probably be more wars in this on-going geopolitical struggle between whoever is in charge of the west and whoever is in charge of Russia in the future, even if NATO and the Russian federation both collapse tomorrow. There’s no way we’re going to make it through the 21st century without intense wars over the vast unexploited resources of Siberia.
Either way, that’s the very short summary.
average leftist meme
but
, this is basically the backbone of a potential essay on why we are against NATO in this conflict and why Putin isn’t Hitler reincarnatedNgl that first paragraph could use a couple line breaks
lol I’m not going to read this, sorry
Nice parroting of Russian talking points!
Leftist indeed.
In 2014, the Ukrainian government was overthrown and the new government shifted towards Western alignment while banning opposition parties. Many people in Ukraine, especially in the east, have cultural ties to Russia and disagreed with the change, but were left with no means of having their voices heard because they were cut out of the democratic process, and that’s why the resistance groups exist in the first place.
“I am not debating you.”
“Here, now let me debate you.”
Ah, by argue I meant something along the lines of “have an upset and angry discussion.” I disagree with some of the premise of what he said though, so I am going to push back on that.
history started the day russia invaded and nothing happened in ukraine between then and the collapse of the USSR.
Good point never thought of it like that before. I love Bill Clinton, Neoliberalism is radical. Did you know he played the saxophone? So cool. Slava USA
Ukraine violated the ceasefire and attacked the DPR and LPR days before the invasion happened:
How many guesses do I get?
First guess: China. Bad.
I think my question was misunderstood.
Your original post makes it seem like you think NATO are the bad guys here because they are supplying weapons to Ukraine to defend themselves.
I asked “who attacked who” because to me, it seems pretty clear that Russia, a dictatorship whose government has a history of human rights violations and disregard for human life, is doing a bad thing when they invade a neighboring country and start shooting missiles at civilian homes on a daily basis for a year and half.
Could you explain how this is not a clear “Russia doing bad thing, we should help Ukraine” situation?
Ukraine to defend themselves.
Do you think the people of eastern ukraine have a right to defend themselves?
Your original post makes it seem like you think NATO are the bad guys here because they are supplying weapons to Ukraine to defend themselves.
nato is willing to fight to the last ukranian, going so far as scuttling peace talks, which you can read about in a ukranian Pravda article about Boris Johnson’s visit.
NATO is mostly responsible for the dead Ukrainians. Ukraine has no reason to fight this war. If they lose, fine, the Russian part gets renamed and a higher minimum wage. Only rich assholes lose out. If Ukraine wins they get dead sons and burned schools but the US oil companies are happy.
It is pretty clear Ukraine shouldn’t be fighting this war for the US companies.
What percentage of Ukrainians support defending their country?
Should it be their decision whether to keep fighting?
If it were up to Ukrainians to collectively decide whether or not to continue the conflict, Zelensky would not have canceled the elections for his position later this year.
The Ukrainian constitution does not allow for elections to be held during periods of martial law, which was declared at the start of the war.
If there is ever a good time to declare martial law, being invaded by a neighboring country might qualify as a justifiable time.
In any case, it’s constitutional, but Ukrainian political process isn’t what we are here to talk about.
Fundamentally, I agree with you - If the majority of Ukrainians were to decide they don’t want the war to continue, the war should stop. The number show, however, that the people are not ready to give up.
Dead people don’t get a vote. People lining up to die are even less trust worthy about their choices.
While humorous, that isn’t actually how polls work. I’d suggest looking up the statistics. The majority of Ukrainians, even in the Eastern regions, still support defending themselves.
Does that mean that the majority of Ukrainians support fighting the war for the sake of US companies? Or could there be something else they are fighting for?
I understood. It’s an unserious question, so I gave an unserious answer. China isn’t militarily supporting Russia. They sent some kids toys and the same raw materials they exported everywhere anyway.
Ah, I see what happened. I didn’t address the China part of your original question because I actually agree with you there. They aren’t militarily supporting Russia based on this article. I don’t see why China would do that, since it wouldn’t really benefit them.
I was addressing part 2 of your comment, where you implied that NATO is doing a bad thing by supporting Ukraine. Unless I misunderstood - I assumed “They are the good guys trying to end the war” was sarcasm.
Don’t bother. There is no actual intelligence or reason there.
You’re responding to the user who refuses to spend five minutes reading a reply, I think you’ve misplaced your estimate of intelligence or reason.
Yes because giving some one the ability to defend their country, and supporting an invasion have the same moral implications
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they sent metal metal. famously russia lacks any source of metals so they needed that for the war
Lol, if the tide of war is changed into Russia’s favor because of alibaba tier drones while Ukraine has western equipment entirely designed as weapons from the start, then the problem is a lot deeper than china supporting Russia’s invasion
In the Vanilla version yes … but this is a more advanced situation …
Got it right in one go, impressed!
Liberals taking pride in being so heavily propagandised is the same as workers taking pride in being overworked and underpaid.
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Focusing on Chinese drones that end up in Russia while completely ignoring the Chinese drones that end up in the Ukraine is some cherry picking I expected from the Telegraph. Products and components are made in China, which shouldn’t come as a surprise.
This is referring to consumer level drones too right? Like DJI stuff?
Ukraine only has consumer drones, I don’t think they have any military drones
I thought they had some for some reason
People need to start distinguishing between the little quadcopters you can buy at walmart, and fucking reaper drones. Headlines like “China is selling drones to Russia” makes it seem like it isn’t a $150 drone bought off fucking aliexpress
That lack of distinction is 100% on purpose since China dominates the consumer drones market and they’re so versatile and capable that countries all over the world including the US buy DJI drones for military operations
Can blame China for giving every country “drones”
china dominates the consumer goods market, period. by these standards the chinese have been supplying every NATO war for the past 20 years.
the chinese have been supplying every NATO war for the past 20 years.
smh revisionism has really gone too far
Gotta get that drones, man…
They do. They have Bayraktar drones.
I do agree that the lack of distinction is kind of stupid.
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However, a year later, nearly all of them are believed to have been shot down by Russian forces.
The remaining killer drones are now reduced to reconnaissance duties, an expert said.
This would mean they still have some.
Pretty sure they have Baryraktar drones, purchased from Turkey, among other military drones.
I don’t think you can buy Bayraktar drones from your local general store…
The Telegraph is the only one reporting this, we’re supposed to believe a sensationalist conservative tabloid?
well if you trade metal to Russia, and metal goes in weapons, you are basically handing them weapons of mass destruction if you think about it
It looks like the data is from Malfar Group which dubs itself as open source intelligence (whatever that means). Looking at their website, it is all Ukraine related. That’s fine in and of itself but it should be noted by them or The Telegraph. But The Telegraph is not exactly a paragon of journalistic integrity.
The Telegraph is a broadsheet not a tabloid for goodness sake.
China is widely suspected of supplying Russia with equipment and materials to support their war, however no-one has adduced anything concrete to support that theory so far.
The article itself doesn’t cite much in the way of sources or evidence, other than mentioning a report by Molfar, the open source intelligence agency. Molfar has published reports on the same topic in the past, but there hasn’t been anything recently.
If the Telegraph had new information or evidence they would be shouting a lot louder than this. This is most likely them covering up for a quiet day by dredging up some old rumours and repackaging them as news.
In other news, China is also widely suspected of supplying Ukraine with equipment and materials to support their war.
Turns out, China isn’t a single entity but a bunch of companies that want to make a whole ton of money by profiteering off of war.
The CCP doesn’t care about the conflict so long as they can claim neutrality.
Beijing issued a 12-point “peace statement” earlier this year that rehashed its position and did not propose any solutions to ending the war.
You obviously didn’t read it then…
Thank you for sharing the link comrade. I should have done it, but I had just 420 blazed it and it would have taken forever for me to find. No 69 unfortunately 🥲
No 69 unfortunately 🥲
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I mean it’s a pretty vacuous statement but what else do they expect? It’s just them trying to please both sides, they cannot exactly make a precise potential peace arrangement without getting everyone together.
It contains points such as “sovereignty should be respected” but no proposal as to how to make Russia respect Ukraine’s sovereignty.
Because it’s about ending the war, not getting Russian leadership to subscribe to an abstract and unevenly defined principle.
So how does China intend to end the war, respecting Ukraine’s sovereignty, without getting Russian leadership to subscribe to the said principle?
Idk, sounds like something that should be hashed out in peace talks, preferably done after calling a ceasefire
A ceasefire at this point would benefit Russia militarily.
And “should”? “preferably”? Are you going to bend reality by the force of moral imperatives?
Russia is unwilling to hold peace talks that involve Ukraine being sovereign and having its territorial integrity intact. According to the Chinese list itself, it’s Russia that needs to make the next step towards peace – by fucking off to behind its own borders.
My brother in Christ, Ukraine is unwilling to hold peace talks with Ukraine being sovereign. The last time they were close to a peace deal Boris Johnson flew his orangutan ass into Ukraine like Marry Poppins and killed the peace deal. Sovereign nations really do get to have Boris Johnson have final say in all decision making.
No way he has any influence in a foreign country, Boris Johnson can’t even influence his own hair. Britain is like irrelevant on a global scale.
Ukraine is absolutely willing to talk about peace, thing is Russia has to leave the country first.
And as you’re bringing up the Brits, are you acquainted with the term “appeasement”?
A ceasefire at this point would benefit Russia militarily.
It would also benefit the people of Ukraine who are currently living in an active warzone.
This should not be difficult to understand.
No. Living under Russian occupation benefits noone.
telegraph getting upset about free markets?
Does reporting on it mean they are upset?
They exercise editorial control and they exercise it vigorously, so when they report on something it’s for a reason.
Does your comment intend to imply they’re just presenting some economic data points or something? It seems kind of inane to pretend that they don’t have a lens where this is a bad thing. That China bad etc etc.
My comment was intending to imply they are not actually upset about this and are reporting on things that will make them money.
It will make them money from readers being upset about it. The author specializes in anti-China outrage bait.
So that would mean others are upset, not them.
My comment had no purpose other than to be pedantic for it’s own sake because that is how the internet has taught me that intelligence is demonstrated and I want to appear intelligent
Wow neat
You seem upset.
One Chinese company sent 1,000 drones to Russia in the two months before the war, according to figures compiled by Molfar Global, an open source research organisation. That firm, Shantou Honghu Plastics, describes itself as a wholesaler of children’s toys on its website and social media profiles.
They are toy drones lmao. Yeah they seem upset alright.
That quote seems very calm to me.
Upset enough to write a whole article about toy drones
How does that mean they are upset?
Chad Xi! 💪💪💪
Ukrainians also get shipped Chinese consumer drones to configure into weapons and Holosuns, so I think it evens out
Telegraph: “One Chinese company sent 1,000 drones to Russia in the two months before the war, according to figures compiled by Molfar Global, an open source research organisation. That firm, Shantou Honghu Plastics, describes itself as a wholesaler of children’s toys on its website and social media profiles.”
“The Ukrainians, and the Russians too, have figured out ways to modify these devices they’ve purchased online to make more and more creative ways to drop explosives from these small consumer drones,”
Telegraph: “Chinese firms have also sent optical sights to more than 50 Russian companies from the start of 2022 through the first quarter of this year. Imports of these products nearly doubled to $2.5 million last year, compared to the one prior.”
https://news.yahoo.com/budget-optics-becoming-combat-proven-212202739.html (it’s yahoo citing Reddit sources and just doing trust me bro, but if Ukraine bought Chinese drones, buying Holosuns isn’t exactly hard to believe)
More informative source: https://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2018/07/25/holosun-optics-on-ukranian-aks/ (lol, a crowdfunding project funding a country’s military is sad, and the fact they could only upgrade 30 guns is even more sad. In 2014 too during the coup)
However, large numbers of Holosun optics have been fielded during the defense of Ukraine. During the war, they have been seen on AK-style rifles, AR-style rifles and even machine guns. While the battlefield performance of the optics is difficult to verify, Ukrainian troops continue to field them. Even bodyguards for Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskyy have been seen using Holosun optics. Outside of Ukraine, the Estonian Defence Forces use Holosun optics on their LMT R-20 assault rifles.
Holopoint stuff is good for the price point. It’s cheap, it’s reasonably reliable and mostly works. If you’re on a budget you could do worse.
A holosun aimpoint mashup brings to mind automatic1111 versions of guns.
I got one great holosun sight, and one shitty one. YMMV.
🥰
Probably not for long given the state of the Rouble and the economy. Tech-wise Russia has nothing to offer and when it comes to the stuff China might be interested in, such as ores and oil, well you’d have to not send miners to the front to continue producing them.
The funniest part of this comment is the idea that Russia will get so desperate for troops that they’ll be unable to operate mines
Soviet industrial capacity greatly increased over the course of WWII
Yeah, but that was the Soviets. These are capitalists. Capitalists suck at war economics and I’m not even sure it’s plausible under modern finance capitalism. I agree they’re not likely to run out of troops any time soon, but I don’t think we’re likely to see economic gains like WWII.
I also don’t think we’re going to see industrial development on par with WWII. My point is that during WWII:
- The USSR suffered something like 25 million deaths, orders of magnitude above even the wildest propaganda about current Russian losses
- They still had the labor power to not only run their industrial base, but to build much of it from scratch
It’s a country of around 143 million, and I saw an (undoubtedly cautious) estimates of 11 million+ military age men. They had something like 1.2 million military personnel before the war.
Just a basic understanding of demographics and even one historical example should tell anyone that “they are so short on people they can’t even run their industry” is absurd.
Tech-wise Russia has nothing to offer
Oh no, their Twitter and Facebook exports are too low. They’ll have to scrape by on checks notes one of the world’s largest supplies of oil, precious metals, and other natural resources. Surely, the Russian economy will collapse any second now!
Plus their weapon systems are probably looking pretty good after surviving a sustained assault from a NATO trained, led, and supplied army.
They provide a large country with a large nuclear arsenal and military that’s friendly to the Chinese government
Russia provides a buffer, it’s the same thing as North Korea. China aids NK to keep US allies as far away from themselves as possible.
